Lived Experience Forum

[Jo-anneJoy]

@Shaz51 

um......there's only seven elements in that pie chart. 

[HenryX]

Hello @Shaz51 and

@Alicat, @Faith-and-Hope , @Former-Member , @Former-Member , @Daisydreamer , @Paperdaisy , @Appleblossom , @Adge , @Scoo , @Dimity , @outlander , @Snowie , @Sans911 ,@MDT , @Former-Member , @Dali , @Wanderer , @Wander , @cloudcore , @tyme , @Former-Member , @Owlunar , @Former-Member , @Peri , @Emelia8 , @Anastasia , @eth , @Olga , @wellwellwellnez , @AussieRecharger , @ShiningStar , @SmilingGecko , @Ant7 , @Eve7 , @Bow , @Determined , @Smc , @Bezak482 , @Jo-anneJoy , @Jo 

{Longish Post ~1000 words}

I love those delineated abilities under the heading "Emotional Maturity"; the only problem is that it makes me weep when I think of the distance between those aspirational goals and my present, self-perceived state of maturity.

Maybe, over the next thirty years, between now and when I'm 100, I will be able to understand and manage the process of acquiring those abilities.

Maturity, to my way of thinking, is not something defined as an absolute, or state of perfection toward which one should strive. I believe that it is more a measure of qualities of character, that are definitely not written in concrete.

I would like to see those goals as something to aspire to, rather than presented as measures of where we should be at.

An emotionally mature person: {My version}

1. Takes reasonable measures to consider the possible outcomes before implementing a course of action.
2. Maintains control of their own feelings, thoughts and behaviours because they know that if they do not maintain control and hold the reins, their feelings, thoughts and behaviours may run uncontrolled, or worse, be controlled by others.
3. Making appropriate decisions and taking personal responsibility for actions and behaviours is dependent on the application and implementation of 1. and 2. above. Because, if one cannot consider possibilities and outcomes and have a reasonable control of feelings, thoughts and behaviour, it is not possible to make appropriate decisions or take personal responsibility for those actions and behaviours.
4. Connecting with others in co-operative and positive ways, I believe, has a lot to do with understanding of self and then reaching out to, for and with others.

Mental Health and Illness issues impact significantly on many of these parameters. Therefore, I believe, that it is all the more important to be gentle with ourselves and nurture ourselves and others, whom we may support, toward these desired goals.

The following material is an extract from the site:

https://www.healthline.com/health/mental-health/emotional-maturity

{The site can be accessed directly via the link above}

Emotional Maturity: What It Looks Like

• {Additional headings that are not included in the extract printed in this post.  What it is , Characteristics , Age and other factors , Test questions , Tips for development , Takeaway}

"What exactly is it?

{Some of these points still come under the heading of what I would refer to as absolutes, but for the most part, I am happy to present these observations. Words in {brackets, in black} have been added by me. Words like  "no matter their circumstances", "always", "privilege", are met, by me, with an element of concern. A few other adjustments {in brackets} will, I hope, be clear. @HenryX }

When we think of someone who’s emotionally mature, we typically picture a person who has a good understanding of who they are.

Even if they don’t have all the answers, an emotionally mature individual gives off a sense of “calm amid the storm.” They’re the ones we look to when going through a difficult time because they {often} perform well under stress.

In other words, emotional maturity is when someone can manage their emotions {no matter their circumstances.?} {In most circumstances}

They know how to respond to tough situations and still keep their cool. It’s a skill set they can consistently work on over time. {Which means that it is not something permanent and defined as an absolute.}

Here’s a look at key characteristics and things we can do to develop emotional maturity.

What are the key characteristics?

Taking responsibility

People with emotional maturity are aware of their {privilege?} in the world and will try to take steps toward changing their behaviour.

This means you don’t blame others (or yourself) when something goes awry.

You possess a spirit of humility — instead of complaining about your circumstances, you become action-oriented. You may ask, “What can I do to improve this situation?”

Showing empathy

Emotionally mature individuals approach life by doing as much good as they can and supporting those around them. {Within the reasonable range of their physical and emotional resources}

You know how to put yourself in someone else’s shoes. Meaning, you often feel {more} concern for others and try to find ways of helping.

Owning mistakes

You know how to apologize when you’ve done wrong. No excuses. You’ll admit your mistakes and try to find ways of rectifying the situation.

You also don’t have the desire to be right all the time. Instead, you’ll acknowledge that you indeed don’t have “all the answers.”

Being unafraid of vulnerability

You’re {always} willing to open up and share your own struggles so others feel less alone.

You’re also not interested in being seen as “perfect” all the time.

Emotional maturity means being honest about your feelings and building trust with those around you because you don’t have an {a self-centred} agenda. {We all have an agenda or agendas, it is how it might be perceived that counts. Are the objectives of the agenda self-centred or inclusive?}

Recognizing and accepting needs

Those with emotional maturity can admit when they need help or when they’re burning out. For example, you’ll acknowledge when you need a break and know when to ask your boss for a day off.

You’re also able to clearly communicate with your partner for more help around the house {or wherever else it may be needed}.

Setting healthy boundaries

Setting healthy boundaries is a form of self-love and respect {for self as well as for others}. You know how and when to define a line and {won’t allow others} to cross it. {strongly encourage others to respect those boundaries - it is not warfare} {How can we expect others to love us more than we are capable of and do love ourselves}

If a colleague belittles or puts you down, you (won’t stand for it) {will respond assertively in defence of your position} and will let your voice be heard."

Ideas which I generally consider an appropriate set of guidelines.

With Best Wishes

@HenryX 

[Jo-anneJoy]

---

The following material is an extract from the site:

https://www.healthline.com/health/mental-health/emotional-maturity

Recognizing and accepting needs

Those with emotional maturity can admit when they need help or when they’re burning out. For example, you’ll acknowledge when you need a break and know when to ask your boss for a day off.

---

Nailed that.  

In my day we called that 'chucking a sickie'.

[Appleblossom]

@Jo-anneJoy 

Ha ha.  We all need humour and the ability to count.

@Shaz51 

Still great posts.  I love this thread.

@HenryX 

Yep. Emotional maturity is a life long journey.

Quoting from your No 3.

"Making appropriate decisions and taking personal responsibility for actions and behaviours is dependent on the application and implementation of 1. and 2. above. Because, if one cannot consider possibilities and outcomes and have a reasonable control of feelings, thoughts and behaviour, it is not possible to make appropriate decisions or take personal responsibility for those actions and behaviours."

Working out what is "appropriate" can be key and a lot of understanding about ages and stages and scenarios matters.

For about 20 years I hated the "appropriate" word, cos nice middle class madams tossed it around and I did not seem to have a clue or an instinct.  It was often used as if people ought to know ... 

I needed to have a long period of reflective understanding the particularly unusual experiences my family went through, rather than judging what is good or bad, right or wrong, or appropriate.

On the emotional maturity line, I was often seen as very emotionally mature, but I was often taken advantage of, cos as willing to help.  When I was doing a fostercare course as an adult, a young social worker, told me off in a damning way ... saying that my maturity was known as being "pseudo mature".  I was gutted and did not respond.  So often when bullied socially, I have quietly moved away and not had a voice to reply.  I have only gained a voice to stand up for myself in last 5 years, and it is only emergent.

[HenryX]

Hi @Appleblossom , @Shaz51 , @Jo-anneJoy , @Wanderer , @Former-Member 

and other members visiting this thread

Yes @Appleblossom , your comment gives me cause to consider, of what it is that I am thinking, when I use the word "appropriate".

I do not view the word "appropriate" as having the connotation of what is good or bad, right or wrong. Rather, to me, it raises the questions of the relative merits {another loaded word} of the factors to be taken into consideration in making decisions. The "factors to be taken into consideration" need carry no pejorative connotation, neither should the appropriateness of any decision derived from those considerations.

Words can be loaded with certain meanings, according to our own experience of their application In our respective life events. Language is, indeed, an imperfect form of communication, but it is the best we've got and so we have to make the best of it.

For me, the word "appropriate" means being consistent with the circumstances, given due consideration, relating to the people for whom it has any consequent effects. etc. In this way it is not an absolute by which anything, thought action or behaviour can be judged but, rather, related to and varying with the environment in which an event takes place.

I am conscious that many of my posts are quite long, so to put the four lines of the previous paragraph in place of the word "appropriate" might be considered in-appropriate. Though not necessarily right or wrong, good or bad, particularly since people have the choice as to whether they read, or do not read the comment.

Your "young social worker" may have done well to consider their own position and attitude in terms of "emotional maturity" and have read up on 'nurturing guidance' rather than 'aggressive correction' and 'accusatory bullying', both the latter of which might be viewed as signs of 'emotional immaturity' and even insecurity.

I am saddened to know of the fairly long lasting effect that the young social worker's words had on you.

With Best Wishes

@HenryX 

[Appleblossom]

Dear Dear @HenryX 

Your response is much APPRECIATED.  I am actually reeling from being heard, but in a good way.

I get that you attempt to be balanced and non judgmental when you use the word 'appropriate'.  I guess my epxeriences hearing it used in a highly judgmental manner was in women talking among themselves and me as usual being on the edge, and not heard or being able to say much, then leaving with the dissatisfactions that I mentioned.  I actually came to think it was an Australian female  triat to be moralistic, without reflection and bullying by nature.  ... I know that is not true but ... it still happens.  After a lot of reading about our culture I came to believe it was because it was so hard to survive that people became hard hearted.  I realise that is biased by me coming from the "bottom of the pile", where hardships were the norm.  

That foster care training was about 15 years ago, but I have a current "social worker" issue. A  neighbour recently moved in who is excessively casual dangles her father and her boyfriend around, but only sees her own child very occasionally.  I have no idea why, but I do not like her and feel my shackles rise when I contemplate her intervention in people's private lives.  

For me public and private have not been clearly delineated in the past.  That was then. I will be on my best behaviour.  Maybe god sent her for me to practise ... non revealing ... keeping it distant and cool ... kind of communications.

I know that masters degrees are pretty common these days and mean less than they did in days of yore ....When doing a course in Counselling ...  the social wkr lecturer was very bitchy to me ... she said ... it was necessary for me to learn that not all social workers were going to help me .... YEP.

I am getting involved in an African street foundation as a way of allowing my desire to 'give back' to ... those in genuine need .... in ways I believe are empowering ... as I do know what it is to be and feel like a "charity case".  I first came across them in 2019, but then was worried I was being played online .... and had mini breakdown due to the coalesence of a dozen significant events.  Somehow have come through that.  Thank God.  The telling thing was that contact was the only person who cared I was alright ... he had also been in orphanages and was a music professional ...I have always known others had it hard.  It is part of why I am pro social ... even if do not succeed in popularity stakes ...or having real life friends.

[Jo-anneJoy]

---

@Appleblossom wrote:

I actually came to think it was an Australian female  triat to be moralistic, without reflection and bullying by nature.  ... I know that is not true but ... it still happens.  After a lot of reading about our culture I came to believe it was because it was so hard to survive that people became hard hearted.  I realise that is biased by me coming from the "bottom of the pile", where hardships were the norm.  ..."

---

I am following what you are describing has been your lived experience @Appleblossom  having risen rooted in the 'bottom of the pile' myself.  When it comes to the traits of Australian females, my contact has only been with those from the Eastern states (excluding Tasmania) and mostly from small country towns and regional cities in Victoria.  My mother and aunts grew up in a semi-desert environment where community revolved around the church - the flagship of authoritarianism and misogyny.  

As my fertile life was coming to it's natural transition, the question rose in my consciousness: How do I understand myself as a white Australian female?  Then as I peeled the onion, my focus became more specific, white Australian female, northern suburbs of Melbourne who is regularly misidentified as a migrant female from southern Europe.  Now I live in a regional city in Victoria where I am regularly informed that my name belongs to another culture.  (Clue: my name is not Jenny, Wendy or Fay)

It is a mystery as to the chronicity of how other people have issues with my identity and ancestry  and think it's appropriate to keep accosting me with their intrusions that are, quite frankly, covert sexism.  I now have the voice to call out the sexism rather than give a lesson on the true origin of my Christian name).  A whole new generation of young males are learning not to get cute with an older white Australian female.

I ride at midnight; who is with me.......

It. Never. Sleeps.

[Appleblossom]

@Jo-anneJoy 

On my good days I will ride with you at midnight.

So some of that strength in women, may also be a refusal to lie down and give up, a kind of spiritedness.  I know Melb Northern suburbs. Possibly I was too sensitive and fragile and just not up to being around tough minded women.  I do not want to diss on my own sex.

You cheer me up. 

Apple

[Jo-anneJoy]

@Appleblossom 

I believe your description of that social worker lecturer and how you felt the target of her lateral violence. It was the generalization that concerned me as that very young women would have been cookie-cut through a particular institution for higher education and just has a Bachelor in Bad Habits.  

[Appleblossom]

Again @Jo-anneJoy Love your humour ... learning to laugh .... been doing it more ....aaahh ... dear ... we def would not want to get a masters in Bad Habits.